First roll of sound film back...

[thebrowniecameraguy]

About 6 months ago I shot a roll of Ektachrome 160 sound movie film in my Elmo 1012 SXL.

So, my first impressions. I have watched it twice now to see how "well" I did, ha!

I thought it would be underexposed much more than this, it looks pretty good.

The sound is a little strange, it sounds like the camera shot the film around 22 fps and not 24. IE: I should have tested the film speed with something at 24 before shooting real sound film. It stays in perfect synchronization, but all of my family's voices including mine are a little lower than they are. I assume it is the camera?

How should I remedy this, I still have a half shot Kodachrome 40 200' sound mag that I want to finish. Unfortunatley, the first half must now have a voices recorded with lower than usual voices.

What to do, what to do?

Thanks,
Jordan

[camera8mm]

I have shot a number of rolls of ektachrome 160 and they always seem to turn out a little green. some shots seem near perfect in color rendition.
I suppose If I wanted to remake soylent green, this would be the way to go.

I usally shhot at 18fps. The sound isnt great but its there and I could clean it up in post.
What do you mean about the sound sounding off? muffled, high in bass?
are the magnetic recording heads clean?

[chachi]

Are you sure its the camera affecting the sound?

Reason i ask is because I had some sound film I shot and ran through my bauer 600T and found that it sounded odd as well. I opened up the projector and found that the belt is no longer tight enough when switching projector speeds, the belt doesn't actually engage the the proper cam, so the speed is always off. I helped the belt over and sure enough it worked.

I do also have sound film which sounds bad and was a result of the camera, but I could hear the camera was not running consistantly while shooting, so i knew to expect it...

[thebrowniecameraguy]

The sound, to me is a little odd. By this I mean, it sounds like my voice is 2 steps lower. If you have no idea what I mean by 2 steps lower, it is a musical term that suggest a note is actualy lower than it is intended. In my case, my family and I and the dog's bark sound about 2 steps lower.

NOT necessarily near slow motion, but enough that we can tell our voices sound different (lower).

My concern: Is this a result of the camera, or the projector? Where can I learn about camera/projector continuity tests?

Thanks,
Jordan

[chachi]

I assume you shot the roll at 24fps, so i would first get a hold of a sound film also filmed at 24fps and test out your projector. This should immediately eliminate the projector as being at fault..

[leadlike]

What type of projector do you have? Most have fine speed adjustments within them. Some are analog controls like on my bolex sm8 where you adjust the screw on a pulley to get right on 24 or 18fps. On my chinon you electronically adjust two potentiometers (one labeled '18' the other '24') to get your sound right. The best test is to get a print of star wars or something and see how it sounds, but even if your projector isn't at fault, you'll still need to do those fine adjustments if you want to hear your film properly. A two fps difference is very, very noticeable to the ear, so it wouldn't take much to have your sound be off.

[danpuddick]

The sound is a little strange, it sounds like the camera shot the film around 22 fps and not 24. IE: I should have tested the film speed with something at 24 before shooting real sound film. It stays in perfect synchronization, but all of my family's voices including mine are a little lower than they are. I assume it is the camera?

How should I remedy this, I still have a half shot Kodachrome 40 200' sound mag that I want to finish. Unfortunatley, the first half must now have a voices recorded with lower than usual voices.

If the voices are deeper when you watch the film then the camera must be running faster than 24fps - not slower - if it is the camera that is not running to speed.

My concern: Is this a result of the camera, or the projector? Where can I learn about camera/projector continuity tests?

It could be either. I teseted my cameras speed by using a sync pluse generator and recoring the pulses straight to Sound Forge (or any visual wave editor) on the PC. I could then see each frame and hilight the gaps and see the time between each frame and therefore know the speed of the camera - plus how long the camera to get to speed etc.

The sound, to me is a little odd. By this I mean, it sounds like my voice is 2 steps lower. If you have no idea what I mean by 2 steps lower, it is a musical term that suggest a note is actualy lower than it is intended. In my case, my family and I and the dog's bark sound about 2 steps lower.

2 steps - 4 semitones lower would be like if the dog barked in F then when you watch it, the 'woof' would be in C#.

69.30hz (F) /87.31hz (C#) * 100 = 79%

So your playback speed is 79% of the recording speed.

That's not to far away from 75% for 24fps films played back at 18fps.

Could you projector not be enganging into the 24fps setting properly.

-----

Wow, that reminded me of Physics lessons at school - so it wan't all a waste of time.


But I guess testing either the speed of the camera or the projector will find culprit.

[thebrowniecameraguy]

Okay, I understand what you are saying.

So, can I interface the pulse socket on the projector to my mic jack on the computer?

Or is something different? What can I use to match up frames, or is that why film was created? Because I only have 1 decent sound film, is this how a sound continuity test is run?

Thanks,
jordan

[tlatosmd]

Wouldn't the first step just be to find a lever or switch from 18fps to 24fps on your projector? I know my uncle has one of the last ELMO projectors ever made as well but I don't know for sure if it's the 1200. Anyway, his speed control for that is on the projector's backside as much as I remember, just as the infinitely variable +/- compensator.