Making a Super-8 Print

[nathan130]

I have a 50ft reel of super-8 Tri-X film (reversal) which I need to get a print made of so I have a second copy.
I'm going to be looping it through a projector and want to have a second copy incase there's any issues with the first either in splicing or extended playing of it.

Suggestions of where I can get this done would be helpful. I'm located in Toronto and the two super-8 labs here already said they can't do it. One of them suggested a place in Berlin but they couldn't recall the name of it.

[richard p. t.]

I don't believe there is anywhere in the world offering a duplicating service for super 8 reversal film (bw or colour). The lab in Berlin they suggested will be Andec. I would suggest the best option is to get a blow up to 16mm made then a print. The print will be on polyester based film and will be more durable than the acetate original. This will be a moderately expensive exercise.
What you could do is re-photograph the film yourself. Use a projector, a white piece of paper and a roll of Plus-X. Then just pull the trigger and re-film as it is projected. You will get a build up in contrast, probably a hot spot, and definitely some pulsing. That said, it can look o.k.
Here is a link to a film I shot on Kodachrome back in 04 or 05. I re-filmed the original kodachrome and doubled the image with a mirror. I then re-re-filmed the resulting rolls with another mirror and had that processed. All was shot on kodachrome.
(ah, I'm on a splashtop browser at the moment and I can't open more than one page at a time, so I can't get that link. But if you search on Vimeo.com for Richard Tuohy you will find my film Cocky-Two.)

[nathan130]

My understanding of how it's done is pretty basic, but if it were an issue of negatives/positives could one not simply make a negative from my positive, and then make a positive from that?
Or alternatively, I've heard they simply run the film one on top of the other through a machine while exposing it as it runs through. Could one not just open up a cartridge of reversal stock and run them through sandwiched together?
I know a few people at school who make their own 16mm prints and got a short answer today from one that a super-8mm print couldn't be done, but maybe I'll ask around tomorrow and try and get the long answer...

[jpolzfuss]

Hi,

the problem is that Kodak (and all other companies) stopped providing a certain film-stock that was needed to do a direct copy from a reversal Super8-film:
http://www.super8.nl/english/e_frame_price_copy.htm

Nevertheless it's still possible (e.g. at Andec) to create a 16mm-/35mm-negative from the Super8-film and then to get a Super8-print from that negative. However the quality of the copy will not be that good this way. And the chance is very high that you'll drop dead when checking the prices...

There's still the chance to find someone with a self-constructed optical printer or to do this yourself, e.g. with one of those "telecine screens". However the quality will suffer a lot when going this way.

Jörg

[richard p. t.]

My understanding of how it's done is pretty basic, but if it were an issue of negatives/positives could one not simply make a negative from my positive, and then make a positive from that?

You say 'simply', but you would need both the stock and the machine (both of which used to exist of course)

Or alternatively, I've heard they simply run the film one on top of the other through a machine while exposing it as it runs through.

Indeed, this is called a 'contact print' where the original is in contact with the print film,emulsion to emulsion. This is the normal way prints are made

Could one not just open up a cartridge of reversal stock and run them through sandwiched together?

YEs, you could do a diy contact print, but this would really require that you could do your own processing. If you can, then no worries, get yourself a super 8 gang synchroniser and bi-pack the original with some more reversal and test the light you need. Then once you know the light, you can make a duplicate and process that.

I know a few people at school who make their own 16mm prints and got a short answer today from one that a super-8mm print couldn't be done, but maybe I'll ask around tomorrow and try and get the long answer...

They will most likely be doing a diy contact print using a 16mm contact printer. Can also be done with a flat bed editor - anything that can bi-pack two films together. The only reason it is different for super 8 is that you need to have such a bi-packable mechanism. You will also most likely have a different stock type to process. They are probably printing onto 3302 or 7302 bw print stock from bw neg. You want to make a duplicate from a positive, so you either need to make a reversal print using reversal stock or make a neg then a positive. Two stages of diy printing would get pretty rough though. Personally I'd go with the diy optical way (like my Cocky film or using a telecine box as suggested above) rather than diy contact.

[christoph]

hiya,
personally i'd make a high quality digital transfer and then film if off the screen. that way you can play around with color correction to avoid too much contrast buildup, and if done properly you dont get any hotspots or pulsing (you could even do it frame by frame with some rigging).
also you can keep it on supper8 and it will be very easy and cheap to make additional copies.

probably worth trying to use plus-x on the copy, to keep the grain more like in the original.
++ c.

[Will2]

You can always invest in an optical printer like this one...


http://www.jkcamera.com/optical_printer.htm

Sure, a little investment but you can make as many prints as you want!

[aj]

hiya,
personally i'd make a high quality digital transfer and then film if off the screen. that way you can play around with color correction to avoid too much contrast buildup, and if done properly you dont get any hotspots or pulsing (you could even do it frame by frame with some rigging).
also you can keep it on supper8 and it will be very easy and cheap to make additional copies.

probably worth trying to use plus-x on the copy, to keep the grain more like in the original.
++ c.

Seems like the best idea.

You could also use a workprinter set up. If there is one in the neighbourhood.
The camera should have enough zoom, be capable of still animation and then still be responsive enough to keep up with 8fps.

Getting the film processed is a time factor. If you don't do home processing you likely need to expose a full cartridge and cannot have clips done.

[aj]

I have a 50ft reel of super-8 Tri-X film (reversal) which I need to get a print made of so I have a second copy.
I'm going to be looping it through a projector and want to have a second copy incase there's any issues with the first either in splicing or extended playing of it.

Suggestions of where I can get this done would be helpful. I'm located in Toronto and the two super-8 labs here already said they can't do it. One of them suggested a place in Berlin but they couldn't recall the name of it.

You have this knowledge and service center in your neighbourhood
http://www.lift.on.ca/mt/